One other big problem we will be paying the bill that some nut in Washington
started and seeing as it was an executive order we know who the nut is. This
chip thing is actually a world thing so that makes it even more scary. so
other countries will be able to access our business even easier then they
can now.What ever happened to America being its own country as it was
supposed to be the freest country in the world.
Kathy
----- Original Message -----
From: "sheri" <balentwineranch@...>
To: <no2nais4horses@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2006 3:20 PM
Subject: Re: [n2n4h] OK so I just lost it on the USDA Here is my spout today


> Your right it will not stop the terrorist.  But, it will give them
> more to use.  Nuts how we tend to create our own problems.  But some
> nut in DC thinks he wants to pay someone to chip the world because he
> has stock in some technology company.
>
> Sheri
> Bale N Twine Ranch
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

Your right it will not stop the terrorist.  But, it will give them
more to use.  Nuts how we tend to create our own problems.  But some
nut in DC thinks he wants to pay someone to chip the world because he
has stock in some technology company.

Sheri
Bale N Twine Ranch

I think it is great that you spouted at them!!  LOL!  Do you think anyone will
ever get the message that we are not thrilled with this??
   I wonder sometimes.
   I will probably be with you on the "list", at least we shall have good
company!




   Kathy Johnson   903/639-1106
   Looking for a home business without having to sell or stock inventory, without
hosting parties, chase your family or friends?  I am ready to help you with an
honest and real home business.
   MomExecs & HomebizExecs
   http://www.momexecs.com/cgi-bin/team.cgi?id=Ka37820&action=show
   http://www.homebizexecs.com/cgi-bin/team.cgi?id=Ka37820&action=show


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Good letter!!!!!!!!!!!! I just unsubed from the animalownersright list
because it was really promoting NAIS. Not all but I couldn't figure out how
it was owners right list and believing the chip was going to help. Some of
them actually believe the chip is good. I don't understand the reasoning. It
can't stop anything. I see  NAIS  giving the enemy more information then
they should have after we are all in the computers. All the enemy will have
to do is hack their computer. It can't stop terrorists.
Kathy









----- Original Message -----
From: "sheri" <balentwineranch@...>
To: <no2nais4horses@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2006 12:56 PM
Subject: [n2n4h] OK so I just lost it on the USDA Here is my spout today


> NAIS
>
> This is a farce and a total waste of taxpayers dollars.  I am amazed
> that you are all so blind.
>
> Are you planning on building bio domes over all farms next?  Just so
> that bugs don't travel from one area to the next.  Are you going to
> micro chip all the farm employees and owners as well then put
> scanners on the gates?
>
> This country can't control rabies.  Or stop spam.  How is it going
> to do this with any real skill?
>
> Personal information was just released to the public through the
> freedom of information act.  How are you going to control this
> information?
>
> I really don't understand have none of you ever been on a old
> fashion farm, with chickens and ducks running around and the pigeons
> coming in for some free food.  Oh, the life that once was before big
> brother went insane.
>
> Next you will be destroying all the wildlife that environmentalist
> have been trying to fix for years because it might be the next
> terrorist weapon.  WAKE UP.
>
>
>
> Sheri
> Bale N Twine Ranch
>
> Guess I will be on the hit list soon.  I told Bush what I thought of
> him in an email right after he went into Iraq.  Figure I am already
> on it.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

NAIS

This is a farce and a total waste of taxpayers dollars.  I am amazed
that you are all so blind.

Are you planning on building bio domes over all farms next?  Just so
that bugs don't travel from one area to the next.  Are you going to
micro chip all the farm employees and owners as well then put
scanners on the gates?

This country can't control rabies.  Or stop spam.  How is it going
to do this with any real skill?

Personal information was just released to the public through the
freedom of information act.  How are you going to control this
information?

I really don't understand have none of you ever been on a old
fashion farm, with chickens and ducks running around and the pigeons
coming in for some free food.  Oh, the life that once was before big
brother went insane.

Next you will be destroying all the wildlife that environmentalist
have been trying to fix for years because it might be the next
terrorist weapon.  WAKE UP.



Sheri
Bale N Twine Ranch

Guess I will be on the hit list soon.  I told Bush what I thought of
him in an email right after he went into Iraq.  Figure I am already
on it.

NYS has been running the census for a few years now.  They did the
dairy cows regularly but not the horses.  The owners started demanding
extra efforts be made on the equine funds so they started getting
regular with the census so that more monies would be allocated for
Equine trails, show grounds, etc.  To promote equines within the
state.  Like the Millineum Classes at the local and state horse shows.

Ex VP of Orange Cty HC

Sheri
Bale N Twine Ranch

yes i saw that the other night about the microchips in people brrr leaves me
cold!!!
on a new subject

political cartoons and dumb joke
i drew 3 political cartoons all about nais...email me at esbee@... if
you would  like to see them...and you have my permission to use them in any way
that will further our cause against nais...just keep the esbee there as my
signature.
joke: Why did the farmer lisp?  Because he had a NAIS-al twang!

susan barackman

   Sent: Monday, February 13, 2006 9:15 PM
   Subject: [n2n4h] Anyone else see this...... Yahoo had it in the news.


   2 Workers Have Chips Embedded Into Them Mon Feb 13, 6:25 PM ET




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

2 Workers Have Chips Embedded Into Them Mon Feb 13, 6:25 PM ET



Tiny silicon chips were embedded into two workers who volunteered to
help test the tagging technology at a surveillance equipment
company, an official said Monday.

The Mexico attorney general's office implanted the so-called RFIDs —
for radio frequency identification chips — in some employees in 2004
to restrict access to secure areas. Implanting them in the workers
at CityWatcher.com is believed to be the first use of the technology
in living humans in the United States.

Sean Darks, chief executive of the company, also had one of the
chips embedded.

"I have one," he said. "I'm not going to ask somebody to do
something I wouldn't do myself. None of my employees are forced to
get the chip to keep their job."

The chips are the size of a grain of rice and a doctor embedded them
in the forearm just under the surface of the skin, Darks said.

They work "like an access card. There's a reader outside the door;
you walk up to the reader, put your arm under it, and it opens the
door," Darks said.

Darks said the implants don't enable CityWatcher.com to track
employees' movements.

"It's a passive chip. It emits no signal whatsoever," Darks
said. "It's the same thing as a keycard."

CityWatcher.com has contracts with six cities to provide cameras and
Internet monitoring of high-crime areas, Darks said. The company is
experimenting with the chips to identify workers with access to
vaults where data and images are kept for police departments, he
said.

The technology predates World War II, but has appeared in numerous
modern adaptations, such as tracking pets, vehicles and commercial
goods at warehouses.

After Hurricane Katrina, as body counts mounted and missing-person
reports multiplied, some morgue workers in Mississippi used the tiny
computer chips to keep track of unidentified remains.

Link is http;//www.thoroughbredtimes.com/todaysnews/newsview.asp?
recno=62234&subsec=5
Thought this might be of interest.
Marianne

Lets hope it isn't for a witch hunt.
Kathy
----- Original Message -----
From: "R. D. Davis" <rdd@...>
To: <no2nais4horses@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2006 8:03 PM
Subject: [n2n4h] Got the attention of the USDA's APHIS


> Well, this afternoon, my web page somehow caught the attention of
> someone at the USDA's APHIS.  Not sure if that's good or bad. :-)
>
> cofc.aphis.usda.gov - - [07/Feb/2006:10:18:17 -0500] "GET
> /equitation/freedom-vs-id.html HTTP/1.1" 200 147715
>
> --
>   R. D. Davis                The difference between humans & other
> animals: an
> www.rddavis.org  410-744-4900    unnatural belief that we're above Nature
> & her
>     Dangling Spiders              other creatures, using dogma to justify
> such
>   Electronic Music Studio           beliefs and to justify much human
> cruelty.
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

Well, this afternoon, my web page somehow caught the attention of
someone at the USDA's APHIS.  Not sure if that's good or bad. :-)

cofc.aphis.usda.gov - - [07/Feb/2006:10:18:17 -0500] "GET
/equitation/freedom-vs-id.html HTTP/1.1" 200 147715

--
    R. D. Davis                The difference between humans & other animals: an
www.rddavis.org  410-744-4900    unnatural belief that we're above Nature & her
      Dangling Spiders              other creatures, using dogma to justify such
    Electronic Music Studio           beliefs and to justify much human cruelty.

Hi,

A quote from something pertaining to a new major addition to the
http://www.rddavis.org/equitation/freedom-vs-id.html web page:

   Newest addition (2/7/2006): Information on diseases affecting horses
   and humans, which is being given as a reason for horses to be included
   in the NAIS. Read this, do your own research, and you will most likely
   see why these are not reasons for horses, or other livestock, to be
   included in the NAIS. This is also a key to understanding how the
   American Horse Council (AHC), and its puppet chapters such as the
   Maryland Horse Council (MHC), utilize propaganda in their attempts to
   benefit political and corporate interests as well as the horse
   slaughter industry as opposed to helping horses and equestrians.

Hopefully some veterinarians or physicians will provide some feedback
pertaining to that addition, which lists various diseases being given
as a reason for the necessity of the NAIS.

Any comments on this?

Robert

--
    R. D. Davis                The difference between humans & other animals: an
www.rddavis.org  410-744-4900    unnatural belief that we're above Nature & her
      Dangling Spiders              other creatures, using dogma to justify such
    Electronic Music Studio           beliefs and to justify much human cruelty.

Quothe Kathy Johnson, from writings of Mon, Feb 06, 2006 at 10:07:55PM -0000:
> Please e-mail your comments NOW before 5 pm TODAY Monday Feb. 6 to
> stop the NAIS and Premises Identification Proposal. There is a meeting
> in Austin, TX this evening and the cut off time for the e-mails is 5
> pm. Please don't let this horrendous proposal pass!

Hopefully they're on central time, not eastern; I didn't see this until
after five o'clock eastern time, and, even though I'm not a Texas
resident, I sent some comments their way.

By the way, some interesting, and perhaps not interesting, lines from
my website's log file:

cs.oag.state.tx.us - - [06/Feb/2006:08:50:52 -0500] "GET
/equitation/freedom-vs\-id.html HTTP/1.0" 200 130633

cs.oag.state.tx.us - - [06/Feb/2006:11:05:03 -0500] "GET
/equitation/freedom-vs\-id.html HTTP/1.0" 304 -

Those show that someone from the Texas Attorney General's office has
looked at the web page.

n005.dhs.gov - - [11/Jan/2006:12:27:22 -0500] "GET /equitation/index.html HTTP/\
1.1" 200 26894

Dept. of Homeland Security, hmmm... probably nothing to be concerned
about though and probably not related to the NAIS issue.

fw1-a.osis.gov - - [31/Dec/2005:12:54:50 -0500] "GET /equitation/index.html
HTT\P/1.0" 200 26894

Does anyone know what type of government agency OASIS is?  I'm not
finding any useful information yet with a Google search.

Robert

--
    R. D. Davis                The difference between humans & other animals: an
www.rddavis.org  410-744-4900    unnatural belief that we're above Nature & her
      Dangling Spiders              other creatures, using dogma to justify such
    Electronic Music Studio           beliefs and to justify much human cruelty.

Please e-mail your comments NOW before 5 pm TODAY Monday Feb. 6 to
stop the NAIS and Premises Identification Proposal. There is a meeting
in Austin, TX this evening and the cut off time for the e-mails is 5
pm. Please don't let this horrendous proposal pass!

Texas Animal Health Commision Addy...mail comments before 5 pm:

comments@...

Word of mouth is probably the only way we are going to let the masses know.
The problem being is the way most in this country don't see the taking of
our freedom. The sleeping city people are going to suffer for this also. The
cost will have to go back to the grocery store. for those of us who love our
animals its going to be very painful as we are losing our precious freedom
and so are our animals.
I do know for many years I didn't pay enough attention and I think our
freedom has been slowly going for years. So many just want protection that
they will give it all up and after its gone they will realize they have lost
something that probably  will never come back. They are taking us with them
though and this makes me angry.. In the end there won't be any protection
just dictatorship. We are very close to it right now.
I just wish there was some way to wake the masses.
One problem we have is China has financed most of the war.
Kathy
.  So, plenty of word of mouth and the
> web seem to be our best options for spreading the news about this.
> What do yo u think?
>
>>





>> gets here. I can't think of another reason for this.
>
> Someone somewhere with the right connections has something to gain by the
> importation of chickens... that's the only other reason that I can think
> of.
>
> Robert
>
> --
>   R. D. Davis                The difference between humans & other
> animals: an
> www.rddavis.org  410-744-4900    unnatural belief that we're above Nature
> & her
>     Dangling Spiders              other creatures, using dogma to justify
> such
>   Electronic Music Studio           beliefs and to justify much human
> cruelty.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Quothe KathyVonDeLinde, from writings of Sat, Feb 04, 2006 at 03:17:25PM -0600:
> I'.ve run into the same thing. I think unless we pay for an ad it isn't
> going to hit allot of papers. I tried one I advertise in and they just
> ignored me. They did have an article though from the U of M about how great
> this was going to be. I tried to get them to put the other side in the
> magazine but it was a no.

Well, good try anyway.  This is very peculiar; something seems to be
very wrong.  The Baltimore Sun had been rather aggressive this past
year on some news reporting---such as exposing how the governor was
planning to sell off some state park land, now, suddenly, a writer
who's worked there for decades was fired on plagiarism charges (which
he denied) after much criticism of the governor, and they seem, at
least to my anyway, less aggressive as far as articles questioning the
state or federal government.  All calls about the news coverage from
readers are now routed to one person with voice mail.  Of course, the
Baltimore Sun is no longer an independent newspaper as it was years
ago, and in turn, it's gobbled up smaller local weekly newspapers and
made them all somewhat alike and bland.

Perhaps what's needed is for people to start small independent
newspapers that won't be bought out or influenced by the powers that
be, but then many people are already drowning in too much information
and aren't interested in more.  So, plenty of word of mouth and the
web seem to be our best options for spreading the news about this.
What do yo u think?

> I find it amazing how many are just ignoring it or think this is going to
> stop abuse and theft..It won't stop abuse as we all know cruel people are

Yes, some people are very much for the NAIS and object to criticism of
it...  many bulletin boards and the rec.equestrian newsgroup, for
example.

> there regardless and as far as theft goes the government will be in all
> reality doing the theft for those that can't afford the micro chip or don't

Precisely.

> want to give up their rights as Americans. After 2008 there will be a
> $1000.00 a day fine. I don't know too many that can afford that.
> the thought of them being able to come on my property and force me to do
> their will. Without even so much as vote which in this country we are

That's worse that the $500 per day fine I was threatened with by
Baltimore County for growing wildflowers and native grasses, which
they determined to be weeds and tall grass (well, the code enforcement
inspector said they weren't weeds, but his supervisor still ordered
the citation to be issued because of complaining neighbors!).  Still
working on that issue.  What's the point of private property if one
can't enjoy it?  Is this creeping communism, a way of attempting to do
away with private property?

> supposed to have.Then if there is a disease on another farm near by they
> will come in and slaughter our beloved animals. Does this sound like the
> America we were led to believe in.

No, it's no longer like the same country, and worse yet, so few people
seem to care---or else they deny that anything is wrong.  Between the
tactics of divide and conquer, keeping people medicated and on "happy
pills" from their doctors, encouraging conformity, etc., apathy only
increases.  Yet, these same apathetic people have the audacity to
celebrate the 4th of July (hypocricy!) and smile and wave as cars of
politicians drive past, as if they think that makes them patriotic.  I
don't go to those parades, but perhaps I should since it's so tempting
go to them to shout things and toss rotten vegetables, etc. at the
politicians riding past, while waving tarred and feathered effigies of
them! :-) Just my two cents worth, anyway.  Sorry to sound like a
grumpy grouch.

It's unfortunate that horses can't run the country for a while, for
they seem to have more sense than most people.

> To think they are shipping in Chickens from China to make sure the bird flu
> gets here. I can't think of another reason for this.

Someone somewhere with the right connections has something to gain by the
importation of chickens... that's the only other reason that I can think
of.

Robert

--
    R. D. Davis                The difference between humans & other animals: an
www.rddavis.org  410-744-4900    unnatural belief that we're above Nature & her
      Dangling Spiders              other creatures, using dogma to justify such
    Electronic Music Studio           beliefs and to justify much human cruelty.

Quothe KathyVonDeLinde, from writings of Sat, Feb 04, 2006 at 03:19:52PM -0600:
> If you read their article very carefully. They are just going to have more
> places as they can't do one big data base as there are too many animals. Yes
> its going to be a state run ID program answering to the USDA. Nothing has
> been gained.

That's what I thought.  It's going to be more difficult to stop it the
way they're implementing it through the states.  Out of the
approximately seventy Maryland state delegates and senators that I
contacted (all of the ones involved in rural committies, etc.) only a
few responded, and only one seemed angry that this is being done.  The
state politicians representing the area where I live ignored what I
wrote to them; I found the office of one of them nearby, and will stop
out there this week to inquire as to why there's been no reply.

--
    R. D. Davis                The difference between humans & other animals: an
www.rddavis.org  410-744-4900    unnatural belief that we're above Nature & her
      Dangling Spiders              other creatures, using dogma to justify such
    Electronic Music Studio           beliefs and to justify much human cruelty.

If you read their article very carefully. They are just going to have more
places as they can't do one big data base as there are too many animals. Yes
its going to be a state run ID program answering to the USDA. Nothing has
been gained.
Kathy
----- Original Message -----
From: "R. D. Davis" <rdd@...>
To: <no2nais4horses@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, February 04, 2006 2:57 PM
Subject: [n2n4h] USDA backing off or not?


> Hi,  Here's something that I just posted over on the stopanimalid.org
> web-site.  It makes me wonder if the USDA is just biding its time and
> doing more planning rather than backing off, or just having the states
> do more of the work.  Did anyone else see this article:
>
>
>
> Excerpts from from an article by Tam Moore,  a Capital Press Staff Writer:
>
>   http://www.organicconsumers.org/ofgu/ID060202.cfm
>
>   DENVER - There won't be a mandatory U.S. animal identification program
> by
>   2009, and the U.S. Department of Agriculture has dropped a 6-month-old
> plan
>   for contracting with a privatized central database to launch the cattle
>   segment of ID.
>
>   That's the message Neil Hammerschmidt, the USDA's National Animal
>   Identification System coordinator, brought last week to
> Ranchers-Cattlemen
>   Action Legal Fund United Stockgrowers of America.
>
>   "We won on ID," R-CALF President Chuck Kiker said after listening to
>   Hammerschmidt's presentation Jan. 20. R-CALF and other ID critics
> questioned
>   the USDA's intention to concentrate the data with a system the rival
> National
>   Cattlemen's Beef Association organized, then spun off as a free-standing
>   nonprofit organization.
>
>    [...]
>
>   Instead of a single database, Hammerschmidt said, USDA, state and tribal
>   animal health agencies will use multiple databases, relying on those who
>   contract with the USDA to furnish livestock tracking information.
>
>   [...]
>
>   The mandatory program is still described this week on the USDA website
> at
>   http://animalid.aphis.usda.gov/nais/index.shtml
>   <http://animalid.aphis.usda.gov/nais/index.shtml . It calls for a
> January
>   2009 implementation of mandatory ID. Hammerschmidt dismissed that plan
> as "a
>   draft" that will be revised.
>
>   He told R-CALF members that on the practical side it would take 2 to 2
> 1/2
>   years for USDA to write and get public comment on complex rules needed
> to
>   implement a mandatory ID scheme.
>
>   "Today there is no one working on rules to implement a mandatory
> program," he
>   said. "We want to see what we can accomplish (on a voluntary basis)
> through
>   market incentives, and we want to see what the market desires."
>
>    [...]
>
> Does anyone get the idea that they're not abandoning this, but
> just delaying it somewhat, hoping that outrage over it will
> die down, while they find ways to overcome some problems that
> they're having with the details of its implementation? Also,
> if the states are still going ahead with this, then the problems
> are far from over. It just looks like they're going to a
> different, decentralized, type of ID tracking system for the
> time being. It doesn't say that they've scrapped the NAIS,
> or that DHS is no longer involved, etc.
>
> What does everyone else think?
>
> Robert
>
> --
>   R. D. Davis                The difference between humans & other
> animals: an
> www.rddavis.org  410-744-4900    unnatural belief that we're above Nature
> & her
>     Dangling Spiders              other creatures, using dogma to justify
> such
>   Electronic Music Studio           beliefs and to justify much human
> cruelty.
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

I'.ve run into the same thing. I think unless we pay for an ad it isn't
going to hit allot of papers. I tried one I advertise in and they just
ignored me. They did have an article though from the U of M about how great
this was going to be. I tried to get them to put the other side in the
magazine but it was a no.
I find it amazing how many are just ignoring it or think this is going to
stop abuse and theft..It won't stop abuse as we all know cruel people are
there regardless and as far as theft goes the government will be in all
reality doing the theft for those that can't afford the micro chip or don't
want to give up their rights as Americans. After 2008 there will be a
$1000.00 a day fine. I don't know too many that can afford that.
the thought of them being able to come on my property and force me to do
their will. Without even so much as vote which in this country we are
supposed to have.Then if there is a disease on another farm near by they
will come in and slaughter our beloved animals. Does this sound like the
America we were led to believe in.
To think they are shipping in Chickens from China to make sure the bird flu
gets here. I can't think of another reason for this.
Kathy

.


> far.  Of course, the general public doesn't seem concerned about this.
> Upon calling a local newspaper, to find out why there was no coverage
> of this, the secretary in the publishers office seemed amused rather
> than outraged over this.
>
> --
>   R. D. Davis                The difference between humans & other
> animals: an
> www.rddavis.org  410-744-4900    unnatural belief that we're above Nature
> & her
>     Dangling Spiders              other creatures, using dogma to justify
> such
>   Electronic Music Studio           beliefs and to justify much human
> cruelty.
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

Hi,  Here's something that I just posted over on the stopanimalid.org
web-site.  It makes me wonder if the USDA is just biding its time and
doing more planning rather than backing off, or just having the states
do more of the work.  Did anyone else see this article:



Excerpts from from an article by Tam Moore,  a Capital Press Staff Writer:

    http://www.organicconsumers.org/ofgu/ID060202.cfm

    DENVER - There won't be a mandatory U.S. animal identification program by
    2009, and the U.S. Department of Agriculture has dropped a 6-month-old plan
    for contracting with a privatized central database to launch the cattle
    segment of ID.

    That's the message Neil Hammerschmidt, the USDA's National Animal
    Identification System coordinator, brought last week to Ranchers-Cattlemen
    Action Legal Fund United Stockgrowers of America.

    "We won on ID," R-CALF President Chuck Kiker said after listening to
    Hammerschmidt's presentation Jan. 20. R-CALF and other ID critics questioned
    the USDA's intention to concentrate the data with a system the rival National
    Cattlemen's Beef Association organized, then spun off as a free-standing
    nonprofit organization.

     [...]

    Instead of a single database, Hammerschmidt said, USDA, state and tribal
    animal health agencies will use multiple databases, relying on those who
    contract with the USDA to furnish livestock tracking information.

    [...]

    The mandatory program is still described this week on the USDA website at
    http://animalid.aphis.usda.gov/nais/index.shtml
    <http://animalid.aphis.usda.gov/nais/index.shtml . It calls for a January
    2009 implementation of mandatory ID. Hammerschmidt dismissed that plan as "a
    draft" that will be revised.

    He told R-CALF members that on the practical side it would take 2 to 2 1/2
    years for USDA to write and get public comment on complex rules needed to
    implement a mandatory ID scheme.

    "Today there is no one working on rules to implement a mandatory program," he
    said. "We want to see what we can accomplish (on a voluntary basis) through
    market incentives, and we want to see what the market desires."

     [...]

Does anyone get the idea that they're not abandoning this, but
just delaying it somewhat, hoping that outrage over it will
die down, while they find ways to overcome some problems that
they're having with the details of its implementation? Also,
if the states are still going ahead with this, then the problems
are far from over. It just looks like they're going to a
different, decentralized, type of ID tracking system for the
time being. It doesn't say that they've scrapped the NAIS,
or that DHS is no longer involved, etc.

What does everyone else think?

Robert

--
    R. D. Davis                The difference between humans & other animals: an
www.rddavis.org  410-744-4900    unnatural belief that we're above Nature & her
      Dangling Spiders              other creatures, using dogma to justify such
    Electronic Music Studio           beliefs and to justify much human cruelty.

Quothe skijorer2003, from writings of Sat, Feb 04, 2006 at 04:40:12PM -0000:
> Your point about the availabilty of medicines in the future is well
> taken, Kathy.  It occured to me that animals slaughtered for food
> cannot even be euthanized as agents like pentabarbitol cannot be
> allowed to enter the food chain.  So many other things routinely
> used in the care of horses could be prohibited.

Hi, according to someone who's been very involved in the movement to
stop horse slaughter, we could end up here with a situation like they
have in the U.K., where many medications that were once easily
obtainable are either no longer available while others have to be kept
behind locked cases in tack shops, etc.  Hopefully they won't attempt
doing that here.

> I tried to get
> Humane Societies takes on this but on none of the many, many
> websites of the bigger organizations is this issue addressed.

Yes, it's very interesting how this is being overlooked.

> I
> finally saw a photo of an animal tagged with a radio frequency
> device and it would seem to me to open up the possibility of
> infection.  Thanks for being here.

One would think that's another possible problem with this, in addition
to the problem pertaining to sarcoids.  I just don't see where the
government has any right to harm our horses; they're just going too
far.  Of course, the general public doesn't seem concerned about this.
Upon calling a local newspaper, to find out why there was no coverage
of this, the secretary in the publishers office seemed amused rather
than outraged over this.

--
    R. D. Davis                The difference between humans & other animals: an
www.rddavis.org  410-744-4900    unnatural belief that we're above Nature & her
      Dangling Spiders              other creatures, using dogma to justify such
    Electronic Music Studio           beliefs and to justify much human cruelty.

Your point about the availabilty of medicines in the future is well taken,
Kathy.  It occured to
me that animals slaughtered for food cannot even be euthanized as agents like
pentabarbitol
cannot be allowed to enter the food chain.  So many other things routinely used
in the care of
horses could be prohibited.  I tried to get  Humane Societies takes on this but
on none of the
many, many websites of the bigger organizations is this issue addressed.  I
finally saw a
photo of an animal tagged with a radio frequency device and it would seem to me
to open up
the possibility of infection.  Thanks for being here.
Marianne

Horses were always included. I think some thought they weren't going to be
because it started by doing the livestock that is eaten. When it started it
was by Executive order so will be hard to defeat. It really is a world ID
program because we are following what he other countries are doing. I would
imagine the slaughter industry that is owned by foreign companies that
export horse meat want this. They will then know everything needed to know
and will know if the horse had any drugs that would be bad if it was
recently wormed. I think our horses will not be able to get some of the
drugs they have been able to get either once this all goes through.
I don't know if the micro chip will hurt but I don't like it either and
don't want my horses to have it. Anything that doesn't belong in the body
shouldn't be there, Most of my horses are freeze branded but it will be just
ignored if this goes through. So we must write letters. This is going to be
hard to defeat if we can at all which is really scaring me.
Seeing as the Patriot act was just extended it is looking bad.
Kathy
----- Original Message -----
From: "skijorer2003" <skijorer2003@...>
To: <no2nais4horses@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 10:32 AM
Subject: [n2n4h] New here


> Sorry to be so ignorant, but would like to know what the initials RFID
> stand for and if the tags
> proposed are painful.  I would not like them in any horse of mine!  Since
> most people in the
> U.S. do not eat horsemeat,  is it meat exporters who are pushing to
> include horses in the
> NAIS program?   I have been told, horses were included in later draftings.
> Can someone set
> me straight on all this, please?
> Marianne
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

Sorry to be so ignorant, but would like to know what the initials RFID stand for
and if the tags
proposed are painful.  I would not like them in any horse of mine!  Since most
people in the
U.S. do not eat horsemeat,  is it meat exporters who are pushing to include
horses in the
NAIS program?   I have been told, horses were included in later draftings.  Can
someone set
me straight on all this, please?
Marianne

Here is one site you can go  to  www.stopanimalid.org.  this has links and
petitions plus flyers.
Hope this helps.
  Kathy
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kathy Johnson" <mamajnsn@...>
To: <no2nais4horses@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, February 01, 2006 9:17 AM
Subject: [n2n4h] new here...


> Hello all, I have just joined this group.
> I am greatly oppossed to NAIS in all forms...
> So sorry to hear you were excluded from a group for a critique of the
> pres... I like the guy, but disagree with some of what he does...
> So, anyway, are ya'll doing anything to get things going?
> Who is riled up?  Got any petitions out there??
> sorry for 50 questions!
> Just feel like we need to be in HIGH GEAR!! (especially since I am a
> Texan, and they are rollin' fast...)
>
> We really need to skin this kitty fast!
>
> So glad to meet ya'll...
> Kathy J.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

Hello all, I have just joined this group.
I am greatly oppossed to NAIS in all forms...
So sorry to hear you were excluded from a group for a critique of the
pres... I like the guy, but disagree with some of what he does...
So, anyway, are ya'll doing anything to get things going?
Who is riled up?  Got any petitions out there??
sorry for 50 questions!
Just feel like we need to be in HIGH GEAR!! (especially since I am a
Texan, and they are rollin' fast...)

We really need to skin this kitty fast!

So glad to meet ya'll...
Kathy J.

Quothe R. D. Davis, from writings of Sun, Jan 29, 2006 at 04:46:45PM -0500:
> sarcoid, and realizing how difficult a horse's sarcoids can be to
> treat successfully, I vehemently object to the government believing
> that it has the right to inflict harm upon our horses, for any reason.

Note: I mentioned that because injecting an RFID chip into a horse
predisposed to sarcoids can possibly trigger a, or another, sarcoid,
thus possibly putting the horse's life in jeopardy.

--
    R. D. Davis                The difference between humans & other animals: an
www.rddavis.org  410-744-4900    unnatural belief that we're above Nature & her
      Dangling Spiders              other creatures, using dogma to justify such
    Electronic Music Studio           beliefs and to justify much human cruelty.

Quothe Timber Creek, from writings of Sat, Jan 28, 2006 at 01:40:43PM -0800:
>     I have to agree with you here.  I have been working on a plan

Hi,

Interestingly, writing that message about hacking the RFID chips, and
criticizing the Bush administration for what it's doing to us,
resulted in my being kicked off of the Americans Against NAIS Yahoo
group; the owner of that list doesn't approve of any criticism of the
president, even though he's responsible for this problem facing us!

>"B".  I thought it would be funny to take the chip out and put it on
>some government vehical--and let them track it down--guess I'm to
>redneck or Indian as the case might be.  There has to be away around

:-)

While I don't like to have to think about the NAIS being implemented,
and a true need for a plan B, I thought that it also might be helpful
to those in areas where the states are already forging ahead with
this, like Texas.

More importantly than anything, however, we must put a stop to the
NAIS since so much is at stake.  Unfortunately, far too many people,
who will be affected know very little, if anything at all, about the
NAIS.  Many of those who are somewhat familiar with the NAIS have been
under the impression that it's voluntary (which it presently is, but
the government plans to make it mandatory) and believe that it will be
good for them and their horses, which it won't.

Speaking as one who's owned by a horse who's been recovering from a
sarcoid, and realizing how difficult a horse's sarcoids can be to
treat successfully, I vehemently object to the government believing
that it has the right to inflict harm upon our horses, for any reason.
Worse yet, to think that the government is putting plans into place to
be able to kill them in the event of a disease outbreak, and even if
they're not ill, is, to say the least, an outrage---and to do so for
the purpose of satisfying foreign horse-meat eaters is inexcusable.
Horses aren't just objects to be tagged and numbered, they're living
beings with thoughts and feelings, they're our friends and they don't
deserve for us to allow the government to institute such program.

>this NAIS.  I am a believer that there is two ways of skinnin a cat.
>We just have to get our heads together to figure it out.

Yes, let's do that! :-) We must bring this to the attention of as many
people as possible.  So far, I've alerted about 170 equestrian
organizations to this, have contacted my congressman and senators;
state delegate and state senators and nearly 70 other state delegates
and state senators in Maryland who are connected with agriculture and
farming (e.g., on committees, etc. connected with that), and went to
the Horse World Expo to hand out flyers and talk to people about the
NAIS.  If enough people will do things like that, we can put a stop to
this.  It's vital that we contact and educate as many people as
possible about the NAIS, and keep letting our politicians know how
much we oppose this; let them know that they won't get your vote if
this goes through.

Also, please contact your local newspapers.  So far, the Baltimore Sun
hasn't run a story on this, but a reporter appeared interested.
Hopefully Lou Dobbs will look into and publicize this (I contacted him
as well) like he's done with the border and overseas outsourcing
situations that most of the media has been ignoring.

One problem that we face is that many people in cities and suburbs,
where most of this nation's population is located, probably won't find
this to be an important issue; it won't affect them in an obvious
manner, and are unlikely to be concerned about this.  Having said
that, we also need to think of ways to get enough of them to think
that this is an important issue to oppose, particularly from a
Constitutional perspective.

Let's put our thinking caps on, try to come up with more ideas, and
keep working at this!

--
    R. D. Davis                The difference between humans & other animals: an
www.rddavis.org  410-744-4900    unnatural belief that we're above Nature & her
      Dangling Spiders              other creatures, using dogma to justify such
    Electronic Music Studio           beliefs and to justify much human cruelty.

Hi,

     I have to agree with you here.  I have been working on a plan "B".  I
thought it would be funny to take the chip out and put it on some government
vehical--and let them track it down--guess I'm to redneck or Indian as the case
might be.  There has to be away around this NAIS.  I am a believer that there is
two ways of skinnin a cat.  We just have to get our heads together to figure it
out.

     Lynda K. Bundrant-Freeman
     Timber Creek Publications
     timbercreek4@...
     509-943-4876
     --------- Original Message -----
     From: R. D. Davis
     To: no2nais4horses@yahoogroups.com
     Cc: Americans_Against_NAIS@yahoogroups.com
     Sent: Saturday, January 28, 2006 10:39 AM
     Subject: [n2n4h] Hacking RFID Chip Data


     Hi everyone,

     Something just occurred to me.  Like most others here, I'm hoping that
     we can defeat the NAIS entirely.   However, should we also not be
     looking into something like the following in event that it still goes
     through, and be prepared to get around part of it by means such as the
     following?

     The USDA tells us what the data format is for the RFID chips.  Now
     then, if we can get hold of a quantity of these chips, and some
     equipment to program them, or else find out what's needed to build the
     equipment to program them (surely there are some other electronics
     hobbyists beside me who are dislike the NAIS), then we can avoid
     actually injecting these into some of our animals.  Please allow me to
     explain.  Get the chips, program them, then temporarily affix them
     under the fur when the vet comes around, etc.  It will appear that the
     animals are ID'd, when they're not really ID's, so the vet won't be
     reporting you for an unregistered animal.  So, if you haven't
     registered your premises, and the vet doesn't know that you're not
     complying, just maybe we can get away with not complying at all with
     the NAIS.

     However, let's say you go riding somewhere with your horse, go to a
     show, etc., you either remove the chip or you put another one with
     fake information on it under the fur to help screw up the system.

     Well, surely there are some other angles on this we can also think
     of...

     Let's not hear anyone whining "Oh but that would be illegal!", :-)
     after all, the NAIS itself is illegal according to the US
     Constitution.

     --
        R. D. Davis                The difference between humans & other animals:
an
     www.rddavis.org  410-744-4900    unnatural belief that we're above Nature &
her
          Dangling Spiders              other creatures, using dogma to justify
such
        Electronic Music Studio           beliefs and to justify much human
cruelty.


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi everyone,

Something just occurred to me.  Like most others here, I'm hoping that
we can defeat the NAIS entirely.   However, should we also not be
looking into something like the following in event that it still goes
through, and be prepared to get around part of it by means such as the
following?

The USDA tells us what the data format is for the RFID chips.  Now
then, if we can get hold of a quantity of these chips, and some
equipment to program them, or else find out what's needed to build the
equipment to program them (surely there are some other electronics
hobbyists beside me who are dislike the NAIS), then we can avoid
actually injecting these into some of our animals.  Please allow me to
explain.  Get the chips, program them, then temporarily affix them
under the fur when the vet comes around, etc.  It will appear that the
animals are ID'd, when they're not really ID's, so the vet won't be
reporting you for an unregistered animal.  So, if you haven't
registered your premises, and the vet doesn't know that you're not
complying, just maybe we can get away with not complying at all with
the NAIS.

However, let's say you go riding somewhere with your horse, go to a
show, etc., you either remove the chip or you put another one with
fake information on it under the fur to help screw up the system.

Well, surely there are some other angles on this we can also think
of...

Let's not hear anyone whining "Oh but that would be illegal!", :-)
after all, the NAIS itself is illegal according to the US
Constitution.

--
    R. D. Davis                The difference between humans & other animals: an
www.rddavis.org  410-744-4900    unnatural belief that we're above Nature & her
      Dangling Spiders              other creatures, using dogma to justify such
    Electronic Music Studio           beliefs and to justify much human cruelty.